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Learning hanzi -- the eternal dilemma of simple or traditional
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AJBryant -

Hi, folks.

I'm new here, and I have a question.

I know the subject of simplified vs. traditional hanzi has been discussed before, but I think this
is a different take.

When I first started studying Mandarin, I found myself -- well, stumped. I really found myself
ambivalent (if that's really the proper word) over which one to learn. So much so, in fact, that
it crippled my ability to learn the language. I realize that the PRC uses simplified, and that
Taiwan, Hong Kong, and traditional literature uses trad forms. Since my primary interest was in
reading historical texts, it seemed that traditional would be the way to go -- but almost every
dictionary I found used simplified hanzi. Likewise, most of the websites (including this forum)
have incredible amounts of SIMPLIFIED hanzi instead of tradional.

So I find myself wondering... did other people find themselves hobbled by their inability to
decide which to do? Is the only way around this really to learn both at the same time?

I'd really like to hear the experiences of others who had to face the decision, and how they made
their choices.

Tony



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muirm -

What I did was learn to write traditional and read simplified (which took minimal effort). That
way, I could read both, hand-write the cooler of the two, and type either (since you just have to
know how to read and speak to input Chinese in pinyin).










shibole -

I just started and decided to go with traditional for a few reasons:
1. My brother, who is fluent in speaking and reading, encouraged me to learn with traditional
since traditional characters often provide better meaning and phonetic clues than simplified.
It seems a bit ironic, but that's what he said.
2. It's probably easier to learn simplified when you already know traditional than the other
way around.
3. Like you I'm interested in old text. Specifically I carve 篆刻 and am interested in seal
characters and other ancient characters, which are of course closer to traditional. Also, some
of the forums and sites that I eventually want to read on these subjects are in traditional
characters.

I'm sort of trying to learn both at once, but I'm only really focusing on Traditional. I have
flashcards that come with both simplified and traditional on the front, but I only practice
writing the traditional. I'm using the traditional version of the textbook that I have.










lilongyue -

I think it really depends on what your motives for learning Chinese are. It's probably best to
just learn both. If you want to be able to read simplified and traditional, I think it's better to
start with one, doesn't matter which is first, and then focus on the other later. Chinese
characters are tricky, and it will take a lot of time and energy to master them, whatever form you
choose to learn.

I started with traditional, but since I live in Mainland China and am studying here in a
university, I've been learning simplified exclusively. Since the difference between two characters
can be as slight as a dot or small stroke (both traditional and simplified), I found that I
couldn't guess or read certain simplified characters whose traditional forms I already knew. A few
easy examples being 变-變, 从-從, 后-後, 么-麼. Honestly I prefer traditional, but I can
always study traditional later. Despite my preference, I have to admit that simplified are easier
to remember, simply because the characters have fewer strokes.










abuck -

I have been learning simplified from the beginning. Writing Chinese was complicated enough for me
without adding more strokes However, just through watching movies with traditional subtitles, I've
been learning a few traditional characters. I guess time will tell if I will need to study
traditional hardcore, but so far I'm concentrating on simplified and hoping that's what I'll see
in most places in mainland China. Interesting question!










yonglin -

Just depends on what you want to do with your Chinese, as stated above.

I've only ever learnt simplified (because all my teaching took place in China or outside China but
with mainland teachers, and exclusively with learning materials printed in the PRC). I used to
find it really difficult to decipher traditional characters, but then I started chatting with this
real nice taiwanese guy and set my sogou to traditional (it's got a lot of errors tho, like, it'll
interpret "toufa" as 頭發 rather than 頭髪), so now I got more and more used to them and don't
fear them anymore. Actually, once you've learnt to recognise the most radical simplifications
(which often are of very commonly used words), you'll be able to guess almost all of the rest (by
character components and context). The point is that the transition simplified-->traditional need
not be 100 times as difficult as traditional-->simplified, as some people make it out here. In
addition, some simplified characters are really more intuitive than their traditional
counterparts, e.g., 泪 and 淚, so it goes both ways.

Handwriting is another issue though, and if you really want to learn how to handwrite traditional
characters, I suggest you focus your early learning to that.










imron -



Quote:

It's probably easier to learn simplified when you already know traditional than the other way
around.

I think it's really much of a muchness. I've only ever learnt simplified, but can usually read
traditional without too much trouble (albeit at a slower speed). Learn whatever you think you'll
end up using the most, and once you have a good grasp of that, learning to recognise the other
form isn't going to be too difficult.










AJBryant -

I should have mentioned that I *do* speak Japanese (I have a master's degree in Japanese, as a
matter of fact). I just find learning sometimes THREE different ways to do the same character a
bit frustrating. ;)

Thanks for the comments, though. Food for thought.


Tony










thph2006 -

I think being practical is a good approach. If you think you'll spend most of your time in
mainland China then starting with simplified just as the Chinese kids do would make a lot of
sense. If your goal is to spend most of your time in Taiwan or mingling with the Chinese
communities in the USA then traditional is the right way to go.

Personally, I've become a convert to the belief that the most important thing is mastering the
spoken language first, so that's what I spend most of my time on these days.

Cheers!










gato -



Quote:

Since my primary interest was in reading historical texts, it seemed that traditional would be the
way to go -- but almost every dictionary I found used simplified hanzi. Likewise, most of the
websites (including this forum) have incredible amounts of SIMPLIFIED hanzi instead of tradional.

What do you mean by reading historical text? Do you mean primary material (originals or copies
thereof) for academic research? Those would be in traditional, and in that case, you should learn
traditional first. If you mean second-hand historical texts, then there are plenty of historical
texts printed in simplified characters published in China that you can order.

As for reading internet material, you can always use a converter to convert simplified to
traditional. See "Tong Wen Tang" listed at http://www.filination.com/blog/2006/...hinese-online/
and http://tongwen.mozdev.org/#english-info

I concur with the others that it's easy to learn one form once you are fluent in the other. It
would probably take only a week's practice for someone fluent in simplified characters to be fully
comfortable reading traditional characters. Learning to write in the other form, of course, would
take much longer.












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